tv MSNBC News Live MSNBC July 30, 2011 8:00am-9:00am EDT
session at 1:00 p.m. eastern. it is planning to debate a debt bill for at least 12 hours before holding a test vote at 1:00 a.m. meantime, the house will be in session too. house gop members plan to vote to strike down that senate measure before it is even passed. now, keep in mind the u.s. could default on its payments in just three short days, so the stakes are higher than ever. last night with lawrence o'donnell on the last word here on msnbc the senate budget committee chairman democrat kent conrad of north dakota said that the republican minority leader mitch mcconnell is now refusing to negotiate on senator reid's plan. >> the minority leader just told the majority leader that he will not negotiate with him. that is really quite extraordinary. the republican leader mcconnell has told the majority leader reid that he will not negotiate with him. he will only negotiate with the
president. i have been here 25 years. i have never heard anything like that. nbc's luke russert is live on capitol hill. luke, good saturday morning to you. >> good morning. >> as we look at what's happening here, by the sounds of it, the two sides appear farther apart than ever. this is the time for them to buckle down and get to work toel together. are they going to be able to do it today, tomorrow, or monday? >> you would think that. the words rationale and commonsense have not been prevalent here in washington over the last three weeks, and it really goes to what is compromise? the gop's original position on compromise was just raising the debt ceiling. essentially what had to be done. that's where the starting point has been, and that's why it's been so difficult really because a blocking minority called them in the house side really these newly elected tea party freshmen that very contrarian and not wanting to allow any type of compromise through over there. speaker boehner took three days
for him in order to get his bill through the house. as to where exactly we'll go in temz of negotiations today, it's all upon the united states senate. harry reid, mitch mcconnell, and we here mitch mcconnell now wants president obama at the table in these types of negotiations. harry reid will try to get a closure vote the around 1:00 a.m. tonight trying to bring over republicans to some sort of comp midz. it's unclear whether you can make that 1:00 a.m. deadline. that is why he needs to get in touch with mcconnell and president obama needs to figure something out over the weekend. >> yeah. you know, luke, the big difference between the house gop plan and the senate democrat plan is that this balanced budget amendment, that's what the gop wants. beyond that, though, both plans seem to call for spending caps for special committees to find more deficit cuts. they almost seem similar, though, when i posed that to chuck todd, he was, like, yeah, but there are very important big points, and they're far apart on those. do you agree with that? it's one of those things which if you had approached this to a
republican last year, they would have signed it in two seconds. the top leadership aides will admit that. to talk about the reid deal. what you see the similarities is trillion dollars in spending, spending caps. the two significant differences, though, are this. it's the balanced budget amendment that was added specifically because the tea party freshmen in the house wanted it in there, and on top of that, democrats do not want to go play for this process again in about six or sech months. they want this to go through 2012 because they say uncertainty will really cripple the economy. also, the number of cuts in the second round that have this commission. both of them have a commission of 12 people to try and figure out how to get the country on better financial footing. the republican bill out of the house that has $1.8 trillion in cuts, republicans have shown that they don't want to really cut the defense department, they don't want to have any tax revenue increase to that $1.8 million, a lot of that would come out of intilgsments. that's where the major differences are. in terms of cutting spend, putting caps in there, trying to raise the debt limit, there are a lot of similities that have
a lot of hill veterans thinking that, okay, a compromise is possible if you can get as one democrat called them, commonsense republicans who are not totally engrained in the partisan ideology on board later today. >> okay. more from you later, but we thank you for this hit. nbc's luke russert there on capitol hill. >> not newt. luke. >> i said nuke. like you're nuking the info out there. now, come on. wake up. here we go. we're both awake now. certainly after that. let's get to the showdown in washington with the debt limit, which is getting pretty strong reaction from wall street. the markets dropped again friday as stock traders are clearly concerned over the possibility of default. joining me now ron insana. good morning to you, ron. >> god bless that young man. >> september he the best? he does get at it with a nuclear reaction. he gets going on it. needless to say, friday not a good day on wall street. at the end of a bad week. >> you know, by -- in terms of sheer numbers, alex, it was the
worst week since early 2011, but in points terms. from a percentage, it's still holding in relatively well. we are starting to see certain market indicators fray at the edges showing that there's increasing sensitivity to the possibility of a default, but it doesn't look like the period leading into 2008 where a lot of indicators were flashing. not just yellow caution signs, but really red warning signs. that hasn't happened yet. perversely, the weak economic data that we had this week may have more influence on the treasury bond market than the threat of default. yields on the ten-year note, the treasury note, to which a lot of other interest rates are tied, mortgages in particular, fell below 2.8%. in europe by contrast worries about a default had led to much higher rates. it seems our bond market is more worried about growth than it is about default or downgrade, which is a very interesting place to be. rates falling instead of going up as everyone had been predicting. >> give me the perspective from the foreign markets and how that plays into all of this. what kind of pressure does that put on?
>> not much. kwhooin is the one country. china and japan. >> they're not being really -- >> they got no place else to go. if they sold treasuries and drove our economy into another recession, they still had such a huge export platform that they suffered just as much as we do if they were to do something and make a political statement like that that they're upset with the way our politics are working in washington. europeans don't have a leg to stabbed on. they have their own problem. they can't give us lectures about our indebtedness when their situation is far worse than our own. there is international concern, japan and china being the two largest outside holders of bonds. the federal reserve being the largest single owner of u.s. treasury bonds, so we can count on them not so sell. this situation is leading to -- this is the worst and most over used expression on wall street, which is that the markets hate uncertainty, and this is a more uncertain environment than i have seen in my adult lifetime, and i think everybody in our age group would suggest that they've not seen a political game played like this down to the wire with
so much at stake. >> and so many people say that damage has already been done in terms of our triple-a credit rating. do you believe that to be true? >> well, moody's actually came out late yesterday and suggested that if we got a debt ceiling increase, they might not downgrade. they'll put us on negative watch for a possible future downgrade pending any advancement on a deficit reduction. >> but negative watch doesn't do anything to our wallets in terms of how we would have to pay out and increase? >> it shouldn't. given the behavior of the bond market right now, given that they know that, it would seem that it would not have an immediate impact on borrowing rates. at least for now. some are arguing that a downgrading won't have an immediate impact on rates given that the bond market, like i said, is more concerned about the bad economic numbers that we've got this week than the threat of default or downgrade. it's a very complicated time, and i have to tell you, really for the first time in many years in my career i cannot accurately anticipate the outcome of all this with respect to the markets.
i don't know what the markets are telling us right now. you know, we're soft in the stock market. bond yields are low. commodities are mixed. there's so many variables at work right now. this being one of the biggest, and, yet, if you were going to tell me for certain that we were going to default monday night, i can't -- i know the stock market will sell off. i don't know what any other market will do. particularly the interest rate market, which is most sensitive to this. my guess is that rates would go up, but, again, with worries about an economic slowdown in place given the gdp report we got yesterday well, really don't know what the bigger concern is at the moment. >> another sobering conversation this morning. thank you very much, ron insana. a bit earlier today i spoke with nbc news political director chuck todd and asked him about the tense and hyper-partisan atmosphere on the hill as this debate rages on. >> i am surprised at some of the heated political rhetoric. john boehner ruined his bill when it became polarized and overly idealogical either with the balanced budget amendment, but then polarized it
rhetorically. do democrats want to be caught in the same trap where they're doing the same thing, using their rhetoric? i was surprised, frens, yesterday that the president made the decision to tap his campaign arm to try to increase pressure. again, this is the -- these last 72 hours should be the time that everybody is trying to calm the political waters, not create this political pressure and this political posturing from the outside so that everybody can get comfortable making a deal at this point, and so i am surprised that we're seeing the heated rhetoric this late in the game. august 3rd, guys, have at it. let's just cut it right now. cut this deal. they're very -- they could be very close. go back to your battle stations and live another day. >> you can hear a lot more from chuck todd on the daily rundown week days at 9:00 a.m. eastern only here on msnbc. meantime accident for an insider's take on this debt debate, i'm joined now live by
democratic congressman paul tonko of new york. thank you for joining us on this very busy day. >> my pleasure, alex. >> sir, i know you told a local tv station that you had received nearly 2,000 phone calling in about a 36-hour period on this debt debate, and i'm going to bet you've had a few more calls since then. >> oh, absolutely. >> what are your constituents telling you about this mess? >> you know, people want fairness. they want to make certain that we focus on those things that matter to them. people in the 21st congressional district of new york have long stated that, you know, it's a priority here should be established to the middle class americans. you know, they've seen tax cuts for millionaires and billionaires and mindless handouts. their concern if they do not solve this potential default crisis, the interest increases on to them will mean, you know, more burdens saddled upon them with student loans, car loans, pension, savings, all the things that affect every strategia of american households, but certainly the middle class has
taken it on the chin, and they're concerned. you know, we have a very thoughtful, very interactive constituency of which i'm very proud. i'm very proud to serve them. they routinely through this discussion over the last six months have been engaged, but it was spiked when the president called upon america to reach to their members of congress and they did that in & about 9-1, about 9-1, people said build a consensus, build a priority for those who have been forgotten over the last decade and a half, and make it work so that our economy is not brought to yet another calamity. i'm curious, sir, because this morning the senate republican whip john kyl delivered the republican address, at which time he said, among other things -- you know what, let's have him speak for himself. here it is. >> democrats claim they would only target the privileged few. behind the scenes they argue for much broader tax increases. the simple fact is in order to afford the kind of government
this president wants taxes would have to be increased dramatically. and for middle income americans, want just on the wealthy. >> what do you make of senator kyl's assertion there, and also that behind the scenes negotiations are different than what the american public is hearing, which was also said? >> look, i can speak most directly to the caucus in which i function. the democrats in the house of representatives. they have throughout this discussion, throughout this dialogue and debate stood for protection of medicare, protection of social security, and making certain that there was fatherness that there was not this continuation of tax cuts for millionaires and billionaires. that upper income strategia had cost us plenty. you know, i think at some 3.5-1 as to how the deficit was grown through the bush administration versus president obama's administration, both presidents have been impacted by a tough economy, but it was a 3.5-1 ratio, well over $5 trillion,
worth of debt sit brought about by president bush's administration. we're saying middle class america is the engine. it enhances all of america, and when you develop a stronger purchasing power for the middle class, the economy is strengthened. we know that the investments here, however this plan is struck, there has to be fairness, and it has to be focussing on the biggest crisis of all. if we grow revenues and cut the spending required when high unemployment is preveiling. >> a lot of people listening right now are applauding your sentiments right there. democratic congressman paul tonko of new york. >> my pleasure, alex. an 11-year-old girl vanishes from her new hampshire home. why was there no amber alert? the fascination with a deadly creature of the deep. why there continues to be so much interest in the great white shark. more on the continued anger and frustration on capitol hill. why can't they all just get
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this morning congress still has want passesed an increase in the debt ceiling. the house friday approved speaker john boehner's plan to raise the bow roar egg limit by a vote of 218-210, but the senate quickly rejected that. both the house and senate returned to work today. joining me from washington is martin frost, former democratic congressman of 26 years from texas. good morning to you. it's nice to have you back. >> good morning. >> so in 26 years i mention you certainly have gone through your periods of tremendous frustration, and tension there
on capitol hill. give me a sense of what's going on right now, and the tenor of things on capitol hill. >> i was chairman of the democratic caucus for four years during that time, and so i have been involved in vote counting. here's a situation that has to play out. you have to get something out of the senate, and then the speaker has to be willing to bring something up and tell the extremes of both parties, okay, vote no, but we have to have a significant block of democrats and a significant block of republicans and if the tea party people want to vote no, if they want to bring down the economy, let them vote no, but you have to have a lot of votes out of each party to finally reach a deal, and that's hard to do, because the speaker always wants a majority of his own party to be the one that carries the day, and you could have a situation where you have a majority of democrats and a minority of republicans, but enough republicans to actually pass something. that causes enormous tension inside the republican conference because they will be seen as not the dominant player here.
>> absolutely. but so my question is how does the speaker or anybody who is the chairman of a caucus like you were going about doing that very delicate dance from a political perspective and then what are the ram ficks down the road? does that leave ill will among these two sides lingering? >> it's not so much a cursor of ill will. it's a case of what's good for the country, and that's what you have to do. you have to sit down with your members and say, look, we don't like everything that's in this deal, but it's in the best interests of the country. we cannot have a default. the speaker has to do the same thing on his side, and he has to be willing to look the tea party people in the eye and say, okay, it's all right if you guys take a hike, but we have to have the rest of the caucus with us. how does -- what happens to the speaker after that? how does he govern once he has had a situation where actually a minority of his party winds up on the preveiling side? that's going to be very interesting to see. i would hope that if that happens that we all come
together and say we had to do this, both parties say it was necessary, we're sorry that we couldn't please everybody nur own respective caucus, but we can't let the country go over the cliff. that's what members are facing right now. members do not want to go back to their home districts when this is over and have people come up to them and say congressman, why didn't you get something done? it's very interesting, alex. i was out in a public concert last night at wolf trap and the people performing, marvin hamish up on the stage and the singers were talking about this, and the audience was responding saying, yes, we need congress to get on with this. that's what they were saying. if those kind of conversations are going on at a concert, you can imagine everybody in the country is saying what's wrong with these people? why can't they get together? >> interesting perspective, as always. former representative martin frost. sir, thanks so much. >> thank you. how the debt ceiling crisis is hurting america's image overseas. we have a live report from london straight ahead. walls can talk.
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the first tropical system of the year has fizzled out. tropical storm don has weakened to a tropical depression. the storm made land fall around midnight right on the texas coastline. it brought little relief to the record-breaking heat in the lone star state. the weather channel's kan kan is live in north padre island, and with another good saturday morning to you, jim. it is a beautiful day. like a postcard. in houston, though, janet shamliyan had rain behind her about half hour ago. that's good news for folks there. >> yeah. it's really weird. they're going to get more of kind of an off chute, a renegade rain than we're going to get here where the landfall point was. that can happen. when you have a system that falls apart like that, they get very lopsided. sometimes the moisture focuses as much as 200 miles, 300 miles away from the center of circulation that's come in, and that is the case. of course, they were just hoping for rain all over texas. we knew we weren't going to get
that, but we even got less than what we expected, alex, and that was worse. look at this. just an absolutely gorgeous beach day here. typically behind the storm you get the big waves coming in. there's a rip current risk. a lot of people out this morning enjoying what was an absolutely gorgeous, gorgeous sunrise. now, what is in the pipeline here as we look down the road? we look east of the lesser an tillies. there's a hash tag on the noaa website. does it come south towards texas late next week, or does it head up the east coast? that is yet to be determined, but that's what we're watching right now, and that could be emily. back to you. >> watching that, plus that beautiful picture behind you. okay, kan kan. we'll see you again. thank you. beautiful. authorities in northern new hampshire have knocked on 300 doors so far in the search for missing 11-year-old girl. celina cass was last seen at her home reportedly monday night. in a major search effort they're
looking for any sign of the girl. michelle franzen is in stewarts ton town, new hampshire. what's the latest from police there? >> well, good morning, alex. investigators are once again arriving here at the command center getting ready to have an internal brooufg and also to fan out and also start searching this area again this morning. again, as you mentioned, celina cass disappeared earlier this week, last seen monday night according to her family, in front of the computer. her family reported her missing on tuesday, and ever since it's been intensifying with each day. you have agencies from as far away as virginia, the fbi's child abduction unit that is also on hand, but still, new hampshire's attorney general is deeming this a missing person's case so far, and that is because they just don't have a lot to go on. she did not fit the criteria of someone who had been abducted. there were no signs of struggle. also, no signs that celina would
have run away. alex. >> okay. michelle franzen, thank you very much. very perplexing story. thanks for that update. no deal yet to the debt ceiling standoff. with a new solution -- will a new solution win the support that it needs to pass? so strong it survives brushing. thankfully, there's listerine® antiseptic. its triple-action formula penetrates biofilm, kills germs and protects your mouth for hours. fight biofilm with listerine®.
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far apart. is the white house hopeful about a compromise? >> well, in the sense that everybody on evert, i think, is hopeful for a compromise at this point. and, yes, you p, it's kind of strange, and i know people get bewilledered, frustrated, angry at washington. all the procedure that goes on here. it's hard to scrutinize and hard to decipher what's happening. when i say the following, it's probably going to prove the point. the fact that john boehner passed something out of the house and it was killed immediately in the senate, that actually clears things up a little bit. it clears away a lot of the underbrush. alex, make no mistake. under the best case stair scenario, we are looking at going up against the deadline between tuesday and wednesday, and that's under the best case scenario. what's happening right now is late last night after they killed john boehner's plan after all of that struggle to get it through the house, you know, we had to throw a bone to the tea party conservatives, throw the balanced budget amendment back on there to get it out of the house. it was largely seen as a face-saving measure, or else boehner as speaker should have crashed and burned right there.
it was also a test at concession that his bill was dead on arrival in the senate as if there was any question of that to begin with. harry reid submits a plan. it is the basis of a compromise for republicans. they only need seven or eight of them. back room negotiations iffing on furiously right now. harry reid, the white house, trying to reach a comendation, trying to put stuff into this bill to get it out of senate. the test scheduled for tonight in the wee hours on sunday. a test vote in the senate. things will be clearer by then, but in the meantime, there's a lot of this back room negotiation going on, and once it passes the senate, it's got to go back to the house, alex, so things far, far from finished. >> indeed. okay. as your day is far from finished, we'll see you next hour. thanks. >> okay. for a bit more on the debt ceiling crisis i'm joined by democratic congressman from michigan, sandra levin, the ranking members of the weighs and means committee. thanks for being here. >> good morning. good morning. >> i want to talk about what
mike was just speaking about, and that being this concession to the tea party to have this balanced budget amendment that they want. categorize the negotiations with the tea party from whatever observations you have been able to see there or just overall the tenor of something like this? there are those that have said the tea party is holding the gop hostage. >> i think they are. essentially the speaker is looking at the needs within his caucus instead of the needs of the united states of america, and that's really unfortunate. here we are a few days away from what could really be a tragedy economically for this country, and we need to worry not about the dynamics within our caucus, but the dynamics for the united states of america. we need certainty -- we need certainty for economic growth. we need sesht for more jobs. instead what the republicans in the house are doing is creating uncertainty. for example, today we're going to have a vote under proposal of
senator reid that is not his proposal. why are we doing this? how many bones have to be given to the tea party. that's a terrible mistake. >> explain to me how this is not the senator's proposal? we understood that's what's coming from senator reid to have a vote and they said it's dead on arrival. almost a tit for tat of what happened last night. >> the vote today, i guess, that's being scheduled by the house republicans is not his proposal. it's not his proposal. they're essentially bringing up something that is not presently being presented by senator reid. we should let the senate proceed to see if they can find a way out of this and then vote on it in the house. instead, what the house republican leadership is doing is trying to preempt this and block it when instead they should be paving the way to settle this. >> okay. you have called john boehner's bill an abducation of
responsibility because it was clearly nowhere in the senate, so if the house republicans send a message that reid's plan or what you say will be presented there, although i'm not sure i'm real clear how that is not senator r50ed's plan. you have been told there will be if nothing else a symbolic vote on the senator's plan, but nonetheless, if this cannot pass the house, should the democrats abandon that and work on something new with the clock nearing the deadline as it is? >> we're working at something new. our leadership is working with senator reid. he has present aid proposal that meets the basic prerecollect quiz its that we've been talking about. instead the house republicans are bringing up a vote on something that is not his proposal as of last night. that's nothing but obstructionist. essentially what they're doing is paving the way. the house republicans. for a christmas present for this nation and that is another potential train wreck.
we should not be doing that. we need to get the train on the tracks, not have another potential train wreck. >> what is the house voting on then, sir, this morning, if not senator reid's proposal? >> it's a proposal a few days ago. it's not the proposal of last night. so, i mean, what's the motivation here? what are they doing except essentially looking at the dynamics within the republican caucus. they put up a proposal last night that they knew was dead before arrival in the senate, so they go through the motions in order to get 218 votes when they know it's going nowhere. >> the thought of that then being implemented as some sort of a shell, if you will, to use to delete some parts, edited out, implement other parts, you don't think that that was the ideology there to at least get something out and passed and something for the senate to look at? >> new york because they knew it was going to be rejected immediately. it wasn't something the senate
was going to look at. the senate did not need something passed by the house in order to act. they are already moving to put something forth to the house. they're playing politics internally. we should not be doing this. we have one goal that has to be in mind, and that is to make sure that the debt ceiling is addressed because no one is entirely sure of the economic consequences. we should be promoting growth instead of promoting politics. >> well, let's hope all that is being done today, sir, on
capitol hill. democratic congressman sandra levin. thank you very much. >> thank you. >> we'll be hearing more from members of congress this morning. we have congressman robert dold who will be joining us at the top of the hour. sflimpl the showdown has world leaders and finance ministers on edge. governments around the globe are keeping a watchful eye on this congress. they're hoping for a last minute compromise. china, of course, the greatest amount of debt, more than $1 trillion in u.s. treasuries is particularly nervous. for more on the scene overseas, let's head overseas to nbc's tazine ahmad in london. europe and elsewhere still working their way on economic slump. what are the leaders saying? >> well, the beg concern is that if, indeed, there's not this translating into a new global economic crisis, financial markets in europe are still reeling and fragile after bailing out greece, and in france they're saying this will lead first to an economic crisis and a social one, and then a political crisis.
germany is insisting that the u.s. owes it to the world to come to a solution and to do it quickly. further afield in pakistan there are worries about the loss of badly needed aid and the impact on anti-terrorism initiatives there, and israel is also saying that this threatens the position that the u.s. holds in the world and this could be construed as a sign of real weakness by countries like iran. here in the u.k. there's a feeling that internal u.s. political wranglings are posing a real threat, alex, to the world financial systems. >> yeah. how about the headlines that people are waking up to over there? are they pretty bold? >> well, actually, you know, it's not really making front page news at the moment. you know, it's -- there is a lot of reaction, and it's been reported as political theater. some of the hldz, though, are about savers desserting the stock because of the debt crisis, how the u.s. is playing with fire as the deadline looms, but, as i say, it's not front page news yet. there are some funny asides.
one paper called is debt-ageddon and one says apple has much more cash than the u.s. government. at the moment the impolitics for the uchl k. and the rest of the world are not really being analyzed in any great depth in british newspapers. not yet. not at the moment, anyway. >> all right. well, not particularly grabbing headlines because there's other news. thank you so much. sflirchlg as for that other news, another member of the royal family is getting married today. who is saying i do. that's coming up in a live report. plus, it's shark week. why the public continues to be fascinate the by the ocean's most feared predator. you know when something's bad -- but you do it anyway? that's me with the blow dryer and the flat iron until i see smoke. so pantene said, "breakage and split ends? no problem." they gave me this pantene called breakage to strength. [ female announcer ] the keratin protection pro-v system helps prevent then repair split ends.
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sports star. stephanie goss is joining us from edinburgh scotland. good morning. tell us about this couple. >> good morning, alex. yeah, they've been gathering here all morning waiting to catch a glimpse of the royal entourage as they pull up to the church. you know, this is a private wedding as opposed to william and catherine's public wedding a few months ago. it's zara phillips. she's the oldest granddaughter of the queen, and she's marrying mike tindale, the captain of england's rugby team. of course, william and catharine had theirs, it's going to pale by comparison. still a big wedding. 400 people on the list. the entire royal aunt rage will be there, including the duke and duchess of came braj themselves, as well as prince harry. they're going to a party afterwards at the queen's residents here in edinburgh. this is supposed to last until 2:00 in the morning.
there will be rugby players there. it's bound to be eventful. >> how many are supposed to attend? >> 400 are supposed to be there. compare that to the nearly 2,000 that were at william and catherine's wedding ceremony. it's a much smaller scale. we've been asking the palace all week to give us some details, and they won't do it because they say this is a private wedding, and as a private wedding, they're keeping those details close to the vest. zara phillips is 13th in line to the throne as compared to william's second in line to the throne, so they handle the situation very differently, but, you know, this ceremony is really reflective of the couple themselves. they've actually been dating for more than seven years. they're described as laid back and very friendly and down to earth kind of people. a smaller scale wedding. a little less public seems to be more their style. >> yeah. of course, the party with the rugby players. one can only imagine afterwards. >> that's right. i'm hoping for my invitation. out i'm out here in my finery. i'm waiting for them to see
they've made a big mistake. >> once they get aload of you, they'll be, like, bring that woman in here. well, the discovery channel kicks off its 24th annual shark week. it all began as way for the average person to have a greater respect for sharks as more than just killing machines. it has become a pop culture summer event. this is the would being-long ooefrt that's hosted by andy samburg, and we'll take a closer look at great white sharks off the coast of california. with us now is andy dehar, shark advisor of the discovery channel and director at the national aaquarium. concerns can be from this california girl about great whites off the coast of california. is that just northern california, because of the cold waters, or do they get south too? >> well, that's our kickoff show this year. great white invasion that premeerz at 9:00 eastern time on the discovery channel, and filmmaker jeff curr is looking at great whites close to shore. you would be surprised right off the santa monica pier, they're
finding small great whites. >> get out. that's disconcerting. you know, people who hear that think are you kidding me? great whites. there are a lot of surfers there in southern california. is it the kind of thing people need to be worried billion, or do shark -- great white sharks really want to go after humans? >> i think we have to understand that the sharks are always going to be part of the ocean. they're there. they're generally speaking not bothering people. you look at the number of people at the ocean every day. they've probably been closer to a shark than they realize, but sometimes mistakes do happen, but by all means, sharks are not out hunting people. >> okay. talk about the fascination we have. why do you think that -- do you think it really got started as a result of the movie "jaws" way back in the 1970s? >> "jaws" certainly played a role, but if you look at old cultures, they revere the shark, the hawaiian culture had a shark god. there has always been a fear and at least a healthy respect for
sharks, but the thing with "jaws" is it was a great horror movie, and it wasn't intended to vilify sharks, and people aren't overly comfortable in the water. there's dark water we can't see below. we're not the most graceful creatures in the water, and that plays into our fears and misconsingeses about sharks. >> these sharks are really quite agile creatures. when you look at them leaping out of the water, it's incredible. it's like they're acrobats. >> yeah. there's a few species of sharks that can come out of the water. the maco shark, the great white, which you are looking at now. this is a one ton animal that can clear its body all the way out of the ocean in search of prey. normally, you know, you're hoping you're not on the other end of that surf board, and they are very good at finding their food. >> needless to say, it's always a ratings blockbuster, and it's good to speak with you about it. >> tune in. thank you. here's how you can do that. shark week starts tomorrow night getting underway at 9:00 eastern on the discovery channel. up next we're going to talk
about a new kind of discrimination to talk about in the workplace. it has nothing to do with race, creed, or color. this bias has to do with job applicants who have been out of a job for more than six months. coming up in our next hour, the red herrings in the debt showdown? what's behind the misdirection effort coming up. ♪ you are my sunshine ♪ my only sunshine ♪ you makes me happy ♪ when skies are grey ♪ you'll never know, dear ♪ how much i love you ♪ please don't take my sunshine away ♪ [ male announcer ] as long as there are babies, they'll be chevy's to bring them home. ♪
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a disturbing new report for americans who are out of work right now. the "new york times" says several employers advertising job vacancies on-line have expressed a preference of people who are already employed or only recently laid off. right now the u.s. department of labor says that out of 14 million americans who are currently unemployed, 6.3 million have been without work for 27 weeks or more. catherine, good morning to you. this is a very disturbing report because these job posts are effectively telling almost half of the millions of unemployed out there don't bother applying.
what's behind this? >> i think employers are saying, well, if you have been out of work for six months or two years or however long, there must be something very wrong with you. maybe you were laid off because you're lazy or incompetent. clearly, a lot of employers have passed over your resume since then. they can't all be wrong. maybe your skills have atrophied or maybe you don't really want to work. probably this is true for some subset of the unemployed today, as it has always been true for some minority of people. when you have 14 million people unemployed, they can't all be lazy, incompetent, and under qualified. i think a lot of people were just caught in the wrong place at the wrong time when the recession hit. >> this begs the question. is this practice legal? >> well, most legal experts that i have spoken with have said it is probably because employment status unlike religion, race, gender, or age is not a protected class.
that is that even though an employer can't explicitly say, you know, i'm not going to hire someone who is block, they can explicit reply say i'm not going to hire someone who is unemployed, just as they could say i'm not going to hire someone who is short or whatever other modifier they want to throw in there. that said, there have been some efforts to add to the body of law that would explicitly make this practice illegal. new jersey has already done so. they said basically if you disqualify people who are unemployed you'll be subject to a fine. new york and michigan are also considering similar legislation and there was a bill introduced in congress earlier this year, although it's unclear how much home yum it has behind it. >> first offense $1,000. second offense and beyond $5,000. you got to wonder how the long-term unemployed americans feel about this. particularly those many of the 6.3 million or so who fall into this category of not having worked for six months or more.
>> i think understandably many of them are very frustrated. they're sort of caught in this catch 22. they need to have a job in order to get ae job, and they feel very trapped. actually, this kind of discrimination is not new to the current economic situation. i was talking about an economist earlier today who was saying that actually in the great depression there was a similar sort of ethos in the marketplace in that a lot of employers were saying we won't hire the elderly or we won't hire, you know, women or whatever, and just as that felt unfair in the great depression, it feels very unfair today. especially for workers who are desperately in need of getting a regular paycheck. >> yeah. absolutely. well, thank you for the update, nonetheless. appreciate that. >> thank you. a make or break moment today in the amanda knox appeal. the battle over dna evidence heats up in her case. we're live in italy with those details. and this new day dawning in washington with no solution yet
to the debt ceiling standoff. there are lots of moving parts down the hill and at the white house. we'll break it all down for you next on msnbc saturday. just one phillips' colon health probiotic cap a day helps defends against occasional constipation, diarrhea, gas and bloating. with three strains of good bacteria to help balance your colon. you had me at "probiotic." [ female announcer ] phillips' colon health. this past year alone you had me at "probiotic." there was a 93% increase in cyber attacks. in financial transactions... on devices...
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time for putting party first is over. the team for compromise on behalf of the american people is now. zirjs we are just three days before the deadline. today both chambers of congress will be in session hoping to end the standoff and save america to make potentially crippling economic crisis. straight ahead, live reports from the white house and capitol hill and expert analysis. keeping it here on msnbc saturday. good morning, everyone. welcome to msnbc saturday. i'm alex witt. let's get to what's happening right now out there.